Updates

Update: 31st March 2016

Well I believed it would take one mistake to break us, but I was wrong, it took eight. After no less than eight accounts put in withdrawal requests over night, we were forced to close our buy hedge earlier this morning due to a margin limitations which left us at the mercy of the market. We have been able to hedge out of situations like this since on no less than four occasions in the past but doing it a fifth time was impossible due to declining free margins. Then unfortunately, as usual, UK data leaked early this afternoon and that spelled the end of it all. It seems UK data leaks will not stop. They have been happening for a year now and its likely to continue as nobody seems to care to investigate.

A few things to clear up:

  1. This was purely my own fault for firstly making the trades in the first place, assuming that nobody would withdraw and that I could hedge out of it as we always do when it goes wrong.
  2. The platform is NOT at fault and there has not been any major wrong doing on their behalf. We were prevented from hedging due to withdrawals of some of our users, not because of being denied access, like on another certain platform.
  3. I take hapniess in only one point of this failure and that is that the people who withdrew will get NOTHING. Frankly, I think their selfish actions warrant this.
  4. I know who the withdrawers were. I did not even have to look it up, but it was apparent when a few people who were complimenting just days earlier starting maliciously jeering when they found out withdrawals would not be processed at the amounts they tried to take. Their behavior says a lot about their character and integrity. With such people in the community, we would have failed eventually regardless of how far we got.Β When the cable retreats to 1.40ish levels, over the next few weeks as Brexit looms, the people who withdrew and left us in this situation will have more regrets than I do, when they realized they would have been sitting on top of $500k balance had this happened. After all their actions show they are more selfish and greedy than the rest of us.

That safely to say is the end of trading for me in a social setting. I have to accept after what happened that my style of high risk trading is not suitable for it since:

  1. I can not rely on everyone who says they are commited to be commited and it only takes a few people to ruin it for the vast majority.
  2. Although people are saying they know the risks and are happy to accept them, many people are trading with money they can not afford to lose.
  3. The influence and comments of others do effect my judgement, as much as I try to say I only factor in my opinion, it is simply not true.
  4. I have proven this time round to myself and everyone, entirely at my own fault that I am neither capable enough, skilled enough or disciplined enough to manage a group account.
  5. It would be irresponsible to cause anymore losses.

With that said I do wish to appologise to everyone for this failure. Afterall I was the captain when we hit the iceberg. I just wish a few people didnt scramble with all the lifeboats leaving the rest of us marooned.

I also wish to say that I immensly enjoyed talking to the vast majority of you and am grateful for all the support and kind wishes in both good times and bad. We had a heck of a ride together, making, losing and remaking hundreds of thousands of dollars together and most of you did stay there till the very end, knowing that we were in all likelihood doomed. I genuinely did try my hardest everyday, everyhour but in the end I could not fight the market and betrayal from small numbers of the PAMM copiers. I tried so hard but it just was not good enough. Thats my failure here.

I would also like to thank HF and my account manager there Bassel for all his help in solving our earlier issues and constant support. They are a good company and none of this is their fault. If you want to continue trading, I suggest you stay with them, I believe you are in good hands.

Whats next for me is that I will be taking some time off to clear my head and emotionally recover from what has happened and then trading again by myself. I just spent a massive amount (for me at this time) on a Bloomberg subscription a few days ago and I want to make use of it and try to at least recover some of my losses from this year. I will use a platform regulated somewhere trustworthy like the UK, North or West Europe as I feel a new start would be best for me. I will try to continue to update the blog a few times a week with what I am doing and what I think is going on, as its therapeutic for me and I actually enjoy communicating with most of you. I believe the good wishes and karma will help me succeed or at least encourage me to keep doing my best. Once again thanks to the vast majority for believing in me and sticking by me, words can not being to describe how terrible I feel about having let us all down.

Mohammed

27 Comments

  1. Speechless, so many mostly positive emotions run through me.
    Thank you Mo!
    How could I miss it mostly all, being sick and on vacation in another country a week later.
    I had a talk with a friend of mine who is working as a trader and he gave some interesting ideas about analysis and his strategies., which like your insights and attitude are also very inspiring!!!

    Thank you Mo, for I am still a sailor on your ship.

    I still fallow you and looking for forward for your blogs and glimpse into your thoughts on the market.
    You have taught me a great deal about it since I joined up in November.

    I have to lick my wounds now, but as I’ve been told in life: if you fall hard, get up and deal with it son.

  2. Hi Mo,

    Thanks for keeping us updated until the end. Thanks for the experience and knowledge that you have shared through it all. Looking forward to more whenever you feel up to it.

    I suppose we are all feeling down, but there are bigger things in life than money and we won’t let this keep us down.

    Please don’t beat yourself up or keep thinking about shouldas and couldas; it’s done and the best we can do is seek to learn and move on.

    Best of luck to us all in the future.

  3. Wishing you the best of luck πŸ™‚
    Hope you make it big πŸ™‚
    Thanx for all the effords πŸ™‚
    Will still drop by the blog and see maybe learn sometings .
    Best wishes Alexander

  4. Hello, i suggest it is now the best time for people to deposit money under your investment and you invest it with very low risk for mid and long term based on ur skill and updated info who want that too? i am in for 1k

      1. Let’s add my opinion on your 5 points, why you quit social (no offense intended):
        1.
        You SHOULD not rely on everyone… you relied too much on us. Law of big numbers. Expect it and take general precautions. There is no betrayal (it’s your emotions), just calculated risk. You took everything personally. Get a little detached (emotionally), that’s a biggie.
        2.
        Aversion to loss. OK. Emotions are strong. You will never make people reason by kind words. Expect it and take general precautions. Were too humble and naive, should have set withdraw penalty to at least 30%. This could have been more effective. It is implemented exactly for these reasons. Am I right?
        3.
        I have to admit, there were times in this short period, when I got freaked out by your emotional hikes. I feel you have got overly dependent on our feedback. And you put your heart into building the community. Beside the trading. I think it’s an immense burden for 1 sole person. Just read my comment from yesterday again.
        How do fund managers (professionals) do their job? How much do they connect with their investors? Did you have an exact idea how this community would function or did you improvise more and went with the stream?
        4.
        I disagree. You are skilled enough, and capable enough. The discipline thing needs deep examination. Would you have done the same mistake even if you traded just for yourself, where there are no noises coming for other people?
        5.
        It would be irresponsible to move on without deep systematic review of every aspect of this HUGE project. Dissect everything. You have succeeded in many aspects and failed in others.
        Weren’t your ambitions set too high? Is it really your incapability, or just could not handle everything alone, or could not foresee future issues? These are just my suggestions. You could use Pareto principle.

        Warm regards

  5. I also would really like if you were not so high risk, but who knows, maybe you will eventually evolve to medium risk, as we all evolve constantly you know? Nothing wrong with that.

    I think you have a really great talent and you also showed great integrity and honesty. All that has no price, so be proud, not sorry.

    I am in if you eventually decide on a new adventure.

    I also hope you keep sharing your thoughts about the market in any case, when you feel better about all this.

    Now have a good break, try to relax and rest, rest assured we certainly do appreciate all your efforts, and I wish you peace of mind and strenght for whatever route you take.

  6. yes with constant medim or low risk only, i think you wont lose any trade, let your followers vote for that when you feel ok. tx

  7. Always in with Mo! I hope we can take the ship in, fix it up, get your captains hat on and sail again! You can’t see it now but you’re building something great!
    Let’s go!! πŸ™‚

  8. Started end of December. Can’t believe it’s all over on two platforms. It all happened so fast. It’s unfortunate.

    Thank you for the master class in high volatility trading. It was fun while it lasted. Too bad, the accounts were not virtual πŸ˜€

    Get some good rest, Mo πŸ˜‰
    I’ll continue to read your blog, but I won’t be trading anymore. Just don’t have the skills and the stomach anymore to take it!

    1. Just some additional comments to your analysis that your style is not suitable for high risk trading.

      1. That is true. However, in the future you could resolve that issue by asking a screenshot from eT**** and HF with their withdrawals before you accept someone.
      2. That is completely true. Same for me. I won’t eat less, but it always hurts to lose $9k and for the past two nights I didn’t get more than 2h of sleep.
      3. I always felt the Twitter account was a mistake. Too many people have a live influence on your trading. The blog was excellent, one update πŸ˜‰
      4. You were risky. But then again, we all wanted you to be risky. You have the trading skills, the problem is that your capital was not under your control. Too much people can deposit and withdraw whenever they want. Before you enter any form of social trading again, that needs to fixed. 1 month to deposit and then 1 year of no withdrawals.
      5. You didn’t put a gun to our head to deposit. We all did it independently.

      Get some rest, analyze what went wrong. Think about how you can improve your performance, i.e. trading for lower yields (15-20%) with a bigger margin. One thing I noticed on HF was that your amount of trades went up dramatically, increasing the odds of a dramatic blow.
      Finally, work on minimizing the emotional component. You are a promising talent now, become a winner in future πŸ˜‰

  9. I think a good option to keep this going would be to se setup your site as a subscription based service, for a small fee a month we can get your analysis and trading suggestions.
    That way you can get a bit of money for your efforts, but would not have to take on the full responsibility of managing some others people’s money. We will all be doing our own trades, in the platforms we choose and under our own full responsibility, but still being a community.

  10. Unfortunately, I cannot write my real feelings and thoughts in English…
    Thank You for that great advanture! Still hoping You will be back as our trader soon. Maybe after You changed a few things with regards to the real excellent analysis stated here today.

    Thomas

  11. Although now may not be the right time for analysing what happened due to the incapability of the brain to analyse thoroughly when emotions are involved, I do agree with most of the points mentioned above. Well, enough analysing for me, in this case, later is better.

    Now, let me tell you that you should never ever give up on your dream to become a fund manager. I deeply believe in you, Mohammed. and I am sure you will make it.

    I am glad that my wishes that you stay with us – even if with no trading – came true and I hope that we will somehow find a way to make it work in the future. I am here and I always will.

    Thank you , Mohammed.

  12. started tradin on etoro with lulinvest, he got some issues and blew his account, I lost alot, then I decided to go with you , you also blew account and I lost, then I followed over to Hotforex after your advise , also ble w account , I dont know if its bad luck or its something more to it, I got message that maybe you blew account on purpose after making deals with etoro,and HForex,,, maybe you got sweet deals for loosing all peoples money , then its a win win for you and etoro , you and Hotforex, I wont accuse you of anything, and I will not be trading anymore,,, I can say I lost a lot of money and its sad , but its only money and I have my integrity left…. Sorry for my bad english….. Really strange this what happend,,, let leave it with that … BEst Regards / Leon Byberg

    1. I think there is no need to accuse anybody. These events surely triggered cognitive dissonance in many of us. It’s understandable that ones are now trying to stick to speculations just to rationalize somehow what happened.

      Why would you blow the account intentionally after repeated efforts to keep it safe? Would make no sense (logically).

      Warm regards

  13. First of all my condoliances to yourself and the more than a thousand people who lost money on your trades. I am sorry.

    Three blown accounts in a few weeks is a great tradgedy from which I really feel sorry.

    The next thing is to try to explain what happened at eToro, then at Hotforex. At Saxo I had no interests.

    When you got that blue star accredited to your name at eToro, you started trading with losses. The market went against you, but you did not follow your main rule from the forums lessons; to cut loosing trades before they crippled you. That is how the misery started. Your fault. We filled up etoro’s bucket as we were warned to jump the ship if our pockets were not big enough to take the loss. I jumped, and rescued a 30%.

    Then you invited us over to HF to trade with you. You had huge drawdowns on four occations and you skillfully recovered into profits. The fifth time you had no chance, the trades were too big for your pockets. Call it bad luck. Then you blamed it on the withdrawers, unjustly! In fact they were not able to withdraw at all, and you could trade with their money all the way down. They contributed to our trading, loosing their last pennies, while you were cheering on their graves. They made your day! You still made them the reason for loosing. That is not fair. They were made the scapegoats. You owe them an apology! I did not withdraw, nor jump the ship. No such intentions. I followed you down!

    I have had the idea that even Hotforex is a bucket shop, not only eToro. Hotforex started off widening the spreads blaming it on the market conditions. Then we all complained to them and threatened to leave their platform. The widening stopped. That clearly showed me they were in control of these tricks. If it was not for them playing games with us, we you would have made huge additional profits to trade with. Then we would not have been in this misery at all. Another fact of theirs is that they did not secure the copiers withdrawals, as you expected. This tells me the same story; bucket shop. They have intersts in their customers losses. Very bad practice. I checked with the regulatory body of Mauritius if they were registered with them, as they claim. The answer was; check for yourself, here is a link to follow. The link was invalid with a “404” message. Total lack of seriousness. My second mail following up the void link was never answered. I hope you do not recommend this shop to anyone, even though you caim they are very helpful and have become friends!

    I am still hugely impressed by your skills, and very grateful for the experience you gave me. I learned a lot. I guess this has been a good lesson for yourself, too.

    We all contributed.

    I still say; well done Mo!

    1. A few things:

      1.) Did not blow 3 accounts in a few weeks at my own fault. I blew one community account in 4 months at my fault. The HF account. E**** banned me from the trader when we were 40% DD at the time and there was NOTHING I could do about it. I’m amazed people still blame me for that even after they accidentally admitted banning me, it shows how irrational angry people can be. Its like blaming the victim of a mugging rather than the actual mugger. As for SAXO not a single other person here had a penny invested there. It was 100% my own and nobody is owed an explanation about it. Period! But fair enough bring it up to rub salt in wounds. For those that arent familiar with SAXO, I turned $10,000 dollars of my money into $300,000 over a period of 10 months (a little more money actually, I made a withdrawal to buy a land rover during the course) and then proceeded to lose it all after listening to Mark Carney and not realizing yet that he was an attention seeking drama queen more interested in being an actor than a banker.

      2.) The trades were not too big for our pockets. We even had them balanced perfectly neutral and had a last game plan to execute. The withdrawers are owned ZERO apology and I stand by my statement that the only joy I take in our crashing is knowing that those who scrambled to get their “20%” left and didnt care about risking everyone else deserve nothing in my opinion and I was clapping when I found out they would get nothing. And who told you that their margins were freely available to trade with all the way down? Were you the one who was called and told why your margin had suddenly shrunk by a huge margin overnight despite equity being the same? Please do not speculate on things if you do not know the whole story in real time. You might think you know what happened but you clearly have no idea. I did not close our already open hedges because I felt like doing it for a laugh, I did it because we were FORCED to do it and we were forced to by eight pending withdrawals over night, requests made AFTER we opened our hedge and explained our game plan.

      3.) I did not use anyone as a scapegoat. I told 100% the truth. That I got us into these trades and was to blame for that. However the truth remains that we were FORCED to close our ALREADY OPEN hedges because of withdrawals. For that they get zero apology from me and I stand by my conviction of condemning their stupidity, selfishness and lack of courage and conviction. I already said that I accept 100% of the blame as the person leading all this, however i feel everyone should know the truth about what happened and why we were forced to close the HEDGE. Is telling people the truth now going to be called using scapegoats? Next you will say that withdrawing at that time was smart of them and tell me to apologize to them all for cancelling our last game plan? Not gonna happen. Could we have failed if they didn’t withdraw? Quite possible. But we had a fighting chance until they did that. You do not see the numbers in real time so you do not know. Please do not comment on things that you do not know.

      4.) I still think as far as platforms go that HF was superior to E**** in terms of support, reliability. I stand by my comments that they did no major wrong doing to us and this failure was my fault not theirs. They never ignored support requests, locked people out of accounts or pulled their platform offline for their own convenience.

      P.s. If you reply please reply with facts and not speculation. Im depressed enough over this already without having to reply to points that are false, wrong or based on speculation. I took the time to do so only this once out of respect for you being there till the very end. And please do not accuse me of using scapegoats again. I have already said over a dozen times that this was 100% my fault.

      1. Don’t be so hard on yourself Mo, it wasn’t your fault, unfortunately you’re at the mercy of the platform’s inability to control people’s withdrawals which contributed to the latest failure. Someone mentioned above if the penalty was higher maybe it would have prevented the unwanteds investing in the first place. It’s supposed to be social trading but these user’s actions is an obvious display of their overall intent which is nothing other than selfishness and greed, and clearly no brass balls of their own with their risk averse behaviour contributing to the demise of the account.

        I stuck with you until the end, we’ve lost an incredible amount over the last few months but it’s been an experience we can all learn from. Thanks for the daily updates and commentary, it says a lot about you and your integrity, you’ve done more than enough to prove your trading skills and abilities. Good luck in life, best wishes.

      2. Thank you very much for your efforts Mo. I am sure you will be very successful in the future, although probably after a little break. πŸ™‚ I stand by my decision to invest in you regardless of the outcome.

        sopihop, a simple Google for FSC Mauritius will allow you to find the public register quite easily. HF are on there. I would post the link for you but it took me less than a minute to find and I didn’t need to email anyone.

        I think to demand an apology is just laughable (besides the fact that Mo has already apologised several times). Everyone knew the risks when they were investing and should not be overly surprised by the outcome. Disappointed, sure, but there is always a significant risk of ruin with such high risk trading.

        If you only invest an amount that you are comfortable losing, then you will not need to be upset when it is lost. I think too many people saw this as a quick route to easy riches with zero effort on their part and invested more money than they were comfortable losing, meaning they quickly turned bitter when things were not going their way.

        I would hazard a guess that Mo suffered more both financially and psychologically than the vast majority of investors these past few months – myself, I cannot imagine what it must feel like to turn $10000 into $300000 in less than a year and then lose it all. Again, I think I speak for the majority of investors here when saying this, so I think almost everyone should keep this in mind before complaining.

        Anyway, Mo, again best of luck in the future and thank you for your efforts. πŸ™‚

  14. Thank you for all your efforts Mo. I wish you all the best and if you’re up for another go drop me a line. I’d take on another adventure with you my friend.

    Chin up, onwards and forwards.. It’s the only way to go!

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